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Mary Rosenblum
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Hello all and welcome to our
Professional Connection live interview tonight!
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Kelly McClymer is the author of
seven historical romances and one young adult romantic comedy. She is a
member of Romance Writers of America, regularly judges in romance writing
contests of all sub-genres and keeps up on the latest deals. Last, but not
least, she has read romance for thirty years. http://kellymcclymer.com
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Kelly, I enjoyed your website.
:-)
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Of course, now you'll have TONS
of contest submissions!
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For a box of Godiva chocolates,
I may submit myself. :-)
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Kelly McClymer
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Oh, my website is woefully
outdated, but I welcome contest entrants anytime.
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My older son is revamping to
give me a new, YA look, but his client (me) is a little slow supplying
content.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Are you going to focus on YA
fiction from now on?
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Kelly McClymer
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I'm not going to focus on YA
only. I will also do adult chicklit, and maybe historical again in the
future.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Ah, chicklit...now there's a
topic I'd like to touch on. But let's begin at the beginning here! I'm
getting ahead of myself. How did you get started writing? And did you begin
with Romance?
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Kelly McClymer
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I got started in writing in
high school. I worked on my school paper and on my school magazine.
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In college I took writing
courses in fiction, and began writing short science fiction.
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I didn't turn to romance until
I decided to tackle a novel length work (very daunting idea to me at the
time!...)
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I thought, as long as I knew
the couple were going to end up together, I could write a long book. And I
did!
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Mary Rosenblum
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How cool! (I'm a SF writer,
mostly). And of course, SF and Romance are now blurring!
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I was delighted with your
breadth of experience in Romance. It is such a HUGE genre. I'm looking
forward to your help in sorting it out for our audience. I see a lot of
confusion among novice writers who want to write Romance but aren't sure
what the 'limits' are.
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Kelly McClymer
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My heart will always belong to
SF, but there's a wonderful place to blend the two, as you say.
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There is only really one
"limit" in romance--the story needs to focus on the couple and
their romantic relationship.
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For example, I can cite an
older example of a time travel romance--Knight in Shining Armor.
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Jude Devereaux threw in
history when her modern day heroine travels back in time, but the focus was
on love.
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Mary Rosenblum
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So how much research must you
do before you write your historical romances? How critical are your
readers?
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Kelly McClymer
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Historical readers tend to be
a picky bunch!
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While a historical romance (or
time travel) may not be as gritty as the historical reality, it needs to
capture the time,
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the realities of the setting
and time period, because that's what makes the readers enjoy a good
historical romance.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Where do you do your research?
And do you intentionally pick a time and place that can be easily
researched? Or is there a 'formula' for periods that Romance publishers
expect to see?
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Kelly McClymer
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Almost every author I know who
does historical romance or mystery has been doing research since birth.
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Okay, not birth, but since
they could read :-) There are great novels and biographies to start with.
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I, myself, love personal
journals because they help capture the feeling of the people without as
much formality.
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And everyone I know who writes
in a historical period choose that period because they love it.
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Mary Rosenblum
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So I’m curious. You wrote an
historical series for your publisher. Were they all set in the same time
period?
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My historical series is set in
the very early Victorian era.
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Kelly McClymer
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That is one of my favorite
times, with the battles women fought to be recognized as individuals.
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So much changed, for women and
men, during Victoria's reign--industrialization changed everything!
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Mary Rosenblum
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No kidding. It was indeed a
time of change. So how much do you know about household furnishings,
clothes, habits, manners, etc? Tons?
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Kelly McClymer
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Ack! What kind of household?
Upper class? Nobility? Someone from rural America?
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That's the danger-you can do
so much research you feel you need to cram it all into the book
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but really what you need to do
is use enough to make your setting real to your readers without
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giving them a mini history
lecture. This is not an easy skill to master.
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Mary Rosenblum
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No kidding. I keep telling my
students that those details are like an iceberg...only the tip shows in the
story.
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Kelly McClymer
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Excellent way to put it! I
probably use about 10% of my research...maybe.
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I try to choose details that
will stand out and reflect the time and place, as well as the characters.
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Mary Rosenblum
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How do you decide what belongs
and what does not? That is a frequent question from new writers.
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And it's pertinent to all
fiction, for that matter!
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Kelly McClymer
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Whether I'm writing historical
romance, YA, or science fiction, I ask myself three questions:
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Am I using this research to
show something important to the characters?
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Is this a fact or detail that
will provide a sensory moment for the reader, to make them feel the time
and place?
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And, last, if I left it out,
would the story suffer?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Those are good criteria, Kelly!
Especially the last...it's so easy to put it in because it's a cool detail,
not because it NEEDS to be there!
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Kelly McClymer
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I learned that last one
writing science fiction :-)
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Mary Rosenblum
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Oh yes. J
SF is a great way to learn 'detail triage'.
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carla
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I'm writing from a journal that
scans many time periods. Is this doable?
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Kelly McClymer
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I'm not sure what you mean
about a journal that scans many time periods--is it research?
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If the shape of your novel is
a journal that covers multiple time periods that could be interesting.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Carla is having trouble with
questions...but she is writing the story as a journal to give us peaks at
the character's life.
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Kelly McClymer
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Ah! As romance, that would not
be doable. As women's fiction--yes!
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I should explain--romance
tends to focus on the romance and is usually a relatively short period of
time, several years.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Ah...so the journal form is not
the problem?
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carla
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Could there be a romance
entwined in the diary?
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Kelly McClymer
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I have seen other books
written in journal form (Bridget Jones leaps to mind). folks, but something
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Mary Rosenblum
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Aha...there you go, Carla. Good
research.
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But even so, you suggest that
she keep the time period short?
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Kelly McClymer
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My take is there should be
romance entwined in every story :-) But there is a difference between
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a romance, and a story with a
romance element or two in it.
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As to time frame with a
journal--there was a wonderful movie (I'm dating myself) called...I can't
remember
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that followed a young black
woman from birth to very old age...it may have been a TV mini series.
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It was told in diary/journal
format...The Diary of Miss Jane Pittman!
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Mary Rosenblum
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Ah!
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Kelly McClymer
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That covered many eras--and
had romance, tragedy and a bit of mystery too.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You mentioned women's fiction.
Can you talk a bit about that that genre covers? It includes chick lit,
right?
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Kelly McClymer
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There's a funny thing
happening in the romance world--we're spawning sub genres right and left.
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But we're also breathing life
into sister genres, too.
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Women's fiction tends (and it
is all fuzzy, keep in mind) to be more uplifting and serious.
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Chicklit has recently begun to
introduce the insouciant heroine.
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The heroine who is not perfect
hair, perfect heart--and thought she may strive for the perfect shoes.
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She doesn't worry as much as
romance or women's fictions heroines about not being perfect in other ways.
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This seems to be a response to
more women putting off marriage and not being tied to family duties.
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Women's fiction, for example,
might have a widow fighting to feed her children, where chicklit
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has a woman fighting to keep
her job and find the right hot guy.
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Mary Rosenblum
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MST asked what genre Jean Auel's
Clan of the Cave Bear be? Would that be historical, do you think?
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Kelly McClymer
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I class Auel's work in
historical fiction
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and really, it is epic in
proportion because it takes several huge novels to cover one woman's life.
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I also love it--that's one
example of where all the research is in the book, and most readers don't
mind.
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carla
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How important is it to know the
genre you are looking to write for when you begin? Can you write it then
figure it out?
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Kelly McClymer
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Oh, Carla, that's a hard
question.
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If your book crosses genres,
you can have a hard time selling it. For example, Laurel Hamilton's books.
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She has a vampire hunter in
love with a vampire and a werewolf...solving a mystery.
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But once the books were
published, they took off...Same with Diana Gabaldon.
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But it is much easier if your
book does not cross genres or break more than one rule at a time.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Although I think today, you're
better off if you happen to cross genres with Romance.
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Mystery, SF, and Fantasy are
all doing romance crossovers.
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Kelly McClymer
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Romance is over half of the
market right now.
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Mary Rosenblum
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We have discovered there are a
HUGE number of readers who love romance out there! LOL
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Kelly McClymer
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Romance subgenres allow for
the crossover without risking losing the reader.
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For example, in Hamilton's series,
the violence makes men enjoy the books more
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but also turns away some of
the core romance readership who are looking for something lighter.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And I think...I may be
wrong...that Laurel Hamilton started out years ago in the SF/Fantasy
universe and then moved into Romance.
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Kelly McClymer
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I think Laurel Hamilton
started out in fantasy, but her strong core romances called to some romance
readers.
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She is an example of what kind
of novel has strong romance but would not be classified, formally, as a
romance.
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carla
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Something along the lines of Mists
of Avalon ... would that be one particular genre or crossing lines? I
have not read Laurel Hamilton's books.
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Kelly McClymer
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Great book, Carla! I loved the
Avalon books. They are definitely high fantasy, but they call to romance
readers.
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The Arthur myths always call
to romance readers, but they are more epic, and not strictly romance.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And Marion Zimmer Bradley was
already very thoroughly established in the classical fantasy universe with
a strong readership.
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Kelly McClymer
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There is a chicklit in the
Arthur universe out--A Connecticut Fashionista in King Arthur's Court.
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Not a romance, a chicklit, but
the focus is on the modern woman time traveling back, not on romance
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or on Arthur, either...that's
just one world that writers and readers love to read about.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Oh, it sounds like a FUN book,
Kelly. I haven't really looked at chicklit and I think I need to. :-)
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Kelly McClymer
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That's something I like about chicklit,
it is fun.
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With chicklit you can have
more than one possible right guy.
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And some writers have
suggested that in chicklit it is less about a right guy than a right-now
guy.
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I think there is no subgenre
of romance (or any literary fiction, actually) that couldn't mine the
Arthur myth.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The protagonists are younger,
aren't they? Isn't the appeal to the 'twenties' readers in chicklit?
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Kelly McClymer
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Chicklit heroines are usually
in their mid twenties to mid thirties (the pre marriage/pre kids).
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But since the genre has really
just begun expanding, there are exceptions--single moms (mom-lit),
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older women (hen-lit), etc. It
is the snarky tone, and the somewhat self centered characters that make it chicklit.
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gwanny
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I want to concentrate on Hen
lit...it's not all romance and silliness as chick lit...you familiar with
the genre?
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Kelly McClymer
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Hen lit is finding an audience
(Julie and Romeo, Ball Step Change, etc).
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It is harder to sell it to the
twenty something editors, but there is an audience for it.
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tkat_2
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Does a chicklit story have a
happy ending? What if there is no "right now guy"?
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Kelly McClymer
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A chicklit story does not have
to have a happy ending--although the ending should be appropriate for the
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story you're telling, and the
tone. For example, The Nanny Diaries.
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Many readers liked the breezy
insightful nanny, but weren't too fond of the rather realistic and less
than upbeat ending.
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Oh--and definitely not a
problem if it turns out there is no right guy right now J
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Mary Rosenblum
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Let's talk about happy endings
for a moment here...aren't they pretty much 'required' for most romance
lines?
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Kelly McClymer
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Most romance requires that the
couple be looking at a future together--whether they tie the knot by the
end or not.
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This is what makes romance romance.
This is the expectation that romance readers have when they pick up a
romance.
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There are always exceptions,
but not many. I can't think of one off the top of my head.
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carla
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So is there is a difference
between crossing a genre and just calling out to another genre?
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Kelly McClymer
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The books that cross genre are
pretty well known--Diana Gabaldon with her Outlander series.
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The question to ask yourself
is: is the book more about the heroine's journey (or the hero's)? Or is it
about the couple?
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If it is about the couple and
the focus is on how they get together, then romance publishers are
interested!
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I should add, this is less
true of mystery and SF publishers--they are still a bit squeamish about too
much romance
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despite the fact that Janet Evanovich's
Plum
series is a wonderful romance-mystery hybrid.
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Although Stephanie Plum can't
make up her mind about a man, so it falls short of a romance.
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There's a historical mystery
series written by Amanda Quick that does fall within romance, because the
focus is
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on the couple's relationship
as they solve mysteries.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Ah that is changing. :-) I just
sold a romance to Asimov's, the top short SF market...and Tor Books has a
SF romance line now. Mystery is less romantically inclined, I think.
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Kelly McClymer
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I wonder if Laurel Hamilton's
success had something to do with that?
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Or perhaps they are tired of
losing good female writers to romance (which happens quite a bit).
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I can't wait to see what Tor
puts out in their romance line.
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Mary Rosenblum
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I think sheer numbers have to
do with it...lots of Romance readers read romantic SF.
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I think Catherine Asaro's books
came out with Tor.
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Kelly McClymer
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Asaro is an interesting case.
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She is a physicist and began
with hard SF, but was asked to tone down her romance.
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Now, she's worked hard to get
romance readers reading her books, and I guess the SF publishers are paying
attention.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And...she is also president of
SFWA, Science Fiction Writers of America and calls herself a romance writer.
:-)
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Kelly McClymer
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The one thing to remember
here--romance is a primarily female market. SF and mystery are used to
catering to men.
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The publishers are scrambling
to re-draw lines they thought were firm.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And those flexible lines are to
the benefit of all writers who do NOT fall neatly into a category!
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Kelly McClymer
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Well, yes.
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And no.
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Because I know of writers who
are told they have too much romance by other publishers.
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And are then told ‘not enough’
by Romance publishers! Frustrating--but persistence pays off.
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Mary Rosenblum
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This has been the case...I've
had that happen to me before...but I think we're seeing a change in how
'romance' is perceived.
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It was kind of sneered at by
other genre publishers
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but Romance readers are getting
MUCH more respect now... that is what I think I’m seeing. What do you
think?
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Kelly McClymer
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I think the numbers in the
marketplace garner respect.
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I also think it causes head
scratching from the male-types.
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The questions are probably
along the lines of "Who wants so much kissing in their books?"
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But the numbers at least
convince them that readers like romance
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and not all romance has a lot
of kissing, either. But there has to be that couple relationship building
thing.
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bud
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From the male perspective...what
about a thirty something guy who discovers his wife of ten years may be
cheating a bit?
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Mary Rosenblum
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ARE there any 'male romance'
lines?
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Kelly McClymer
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There is a type of lad lit.
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It is not considered romance,
per se.
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The movie About A Boy is cited
as an example (I love that movie!).
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But from what I hear, it's a
very small niche.
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The man who finds out his wife
might be cheating sounds like a little older variation of lad lit.
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Could definitely fit in, but
romance publishers might be wary of introducing it to their female readers
as romance.
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I think it would come down to
whether or not it was something women wrinkle their noses at, or nod their
heads at.
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Waller is one of those authors
who perpetually kills off his hero or heroine--and that's not generally
going to lead to a good future
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and romance readers want to
close the book thinking the future is just a bit brighter for the
characters.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Yeah, killing your MC does dim
that future just a bit! :-)
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Kelly, I'd like to ask you for
a
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rundown of the subgenres
covered by that blanket term: Romance. Some novice writers find it
bewildering.
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Kelly McClymer
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Okay.
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Historical romance--covers a
romance in one historical era.
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Timetravel--covers romance
that spans two (or more) time periods.
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Paranormal--has elements of
the paranormal, like witches, vampires, ghosts, etc. (occasionally one of
these is part of the couple)
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Regency romance--this is a
subset of historical romance with its own tight rules, set between
1796-1819.
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Romantic suspense--this is
romance blended with danger, the couple is usually on the run, and the
stakes are life and death.
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Romantic Comedy--this is
usually a lighter romance, where the couple can be as slapstick as Lucy and
Desi, or witty and dry
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Romance with Mystery--there is
often an element of mystery in romance, so this isn't technically its own
subgenre.
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All of my historical romances
have a hint of mystery, as does my YA coming out in the spring, and the
series I have coming out in the fall.
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The secret is, romance
readers--and writers--love a splash of mystery in every book J
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Futuristic Romance--this is
the sf subgenre of romance, other planets, earth in the future, space
colonies, etc.
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Inspirational romance--this is
for those who also want an element of faith, and a little less sex in their
romances.
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Erotic romance--this is for
those who want more sex and less "other stuff" and this one I
don't know a lot about
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except that it is a growing
market...
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And that's part of the
interesting thing about romance--both inspirational romance and erotic
romance are growing markets.
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Last, but not least, is
contemporary romance--happens in the here and now and focuses on the
romantic relationship
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without many other
complications.
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Most everyone knows of
Harlequin as a romance publisher, and they are the masters of the
contemporary romance.
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But a single title
contemporary romance writer is someone like Susan Elizabeth Philips (some
of her books slide into romantic comedy)
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And a sister genre is women's
fiction--stories about women surviving divorce, cancer, broken friendships,
serious and funny.
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And I mentioned chicklit
already (which is spawning its own subgenres of mom-lit, hen-lit, lad-lit).
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I think that's it for a
thumbnail sketch of the subgenres--but if there are questions on what's
what, please ask!
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sallyk
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How do you do your market
research?
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Mary Rosenblum
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How does a novice find out who
publishes what?
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Kelly McClymer
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The right publisher (in my
definition) is the one who believes in your book and buys it. You can find
that publisher
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more quickly by taking the
stack of books you've read that are like yours (I'm assuming we're all avid
readers).
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Check the spine or the
copyright page for the publisher's info. That's the first place to start.
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Of course, if you haven't
heard of a book like yours, then you have to go to the library, or the
bookstore and
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read a lot of cover blurbs in
various sections.
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You're not looking for
something exactly like what you've written (which would just be depressing!)
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You're looking for someone
who, say, publishes time travel romance, or "issue" fiction that
deals with cancer/death etc.
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Of course, getting an agent is
a great shortcut--but finding the right agent can often be as frustrating
as finding the right publisher.
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Again, if you want to write
romance mixed with science fiction, you need to look for an agent who
handles both.
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That's the person who will
understand what you're trying to do.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Do you have an agent and did
you acquire one before you sold your first book or after?
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Kelly McClymer
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Oh, agent stories! I'm on my
fourth agent right now (I love them all, but things happen).
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My first agent did not sell
anything for me. My second agent made my first (3 book) sale.
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My third agent sold books 4-7.
My newest agent sold books 8-10. I believe in agents.
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What my agents did, always,
was make things happen faster because they knew the right people to get my
books to.
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And they also helped me
navigate the fun contract stuff too.
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Oh! I forgot one romance genre
that is hot right now--YA romance!
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Mary Rosenblum
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I was intrigued by your
series...and you have a new one starting soon, too, right? Did you propose
a series to your publisher? Or did they ask for it?
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Kelly McClymer
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For my first, historical
series, my agent sent one book in to the editor.
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The editor said to my agent,
"Can she do a series with the sisters?" My agent asked me. I said
"Yes!"
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Mary Rosenblum
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cool!
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Kelly McClymer
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The second series I'm doing (a
teenaged witch-cheerleader YA series, starting with THE SALEM WITH
TRYOUTS).
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My agent pitched as a series,
since that was how I envisioned it.
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She could have pitched it as a
stand alone, if she thought that would make it more interesting--but
because of the premise
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the pitch worked better as a
standalone. One thing I've learned, it is tricky to pitch a series, unless
that's what the publisher is looking for.
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Most publishers don't like to
contract for more than three books at a time, and usually they prefer two.
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They are wedded to their
numbers, and since it takes a year to get a book out, and then another six
months to get
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sales figures, that actually
does make business sense.
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Also, as my agent said, when
she advised me she wasn't going to try to lock in a three book series, if
the series goes well
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the writer wants to reap the
advance benefit in the next contract negotiations.
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Mary Rosenblum
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What about short fiction
markets for Romance?
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It seems to be mostly a novel
genre?
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Kelly McClymer
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There used to be many outlets
for short romantic fiction, with the women's magazines. Nowadays, not so
much.
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There are magazines like True
Confessions (that pay well!) and Woman's World (very short
stories), as traditional avenues.
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There are also some on-line
romantic fiction magazines that will accept longer stories. The two I liked
the most just went out of business a few months ago.
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But for subgenre stories,
there are always the science fiction (Isaac Asimov and Analog),
mystery (Ellery Queen and Alfred Hitchcock)
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and fantasy (Fantasy and
Science Fiction, Realms of Fantasy)...
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I'm not sure why romantic
story magazines don't do well. Pure speculation, plus my own reading
preferences
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suggest that it may be that
romance readers like to immerse themselves in a story, and that is
difficult to do in 10-20 pages.
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Mary Rosenblum
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There's also a very nice new
online magazine: Romance Rendezvous, edited by Jean Lauzier. She has done a
great job.
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www.theromanceplace.com
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She is even paying.
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Kelly McClymer
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Romance Rendezvous? I haven't
heard of that. I'm going to check it out. I was desolate when Wax Romantic
stopped accepting.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Jean was editor for WR and
started the new site.
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Do check it out. Nice magazine.
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Kelly McClymer
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Wow! That's the thing about
the short markets--and the long ones--you have to keep your ear to the ground!
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Mary Rosenblum
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No kidding. The name is new, so
do pass it around. She publishes good stories, too.
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Before we run out of time
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I wanted to find out what you
have coming up. A new series, right?
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Kelly McClymer
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Before the series comes out in
the fall of 2007, I have a YA romantic comedy coming out in March.
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GETTING TO THIRD DATE is not
part of the witch cheerleader series, it is a stand alone romantic comedy.
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The editor who bought my YA
series liked one of my adult proposals and asked me to turn it into YA. So
I did.
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Since the original premise was
adult, I had to re-envision for a college freshman age young woman. Katelyn
Spears was born
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and given a challenge--give a
third date to all the boys she'd given up on by the second date.
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Katelyn's motto is that
everyone deserves a second chance, but the third date is only for those who
have more than a little potential.
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And then, in October, SALEM
WITCH TRYOUTS comes out. This is a book that came to me because I overheard
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something said and got it
wrong (they said Salem Witch Trials...and that's not what I heard and a
book bloomed in my mind.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It's a great title!
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Kelly McClymer
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So I have a character who is
something like Tabitha from Bewitched, with a younger brother who is
getting into trouble.
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The family moves from Beverly Hills to Salem and my perfect
cheerleader heroine has to take remedial magic classes.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Sounds like a LOT of fun!
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I will look for it. J Kelly,
thanks so much for coming. You have been a great guest and very
informative.
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Kelly McClymer
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It was a lot of fun to write
(I'm working on the second book in the series now--and envisioning more of
how witches cheerlead.
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Thank you!
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tkat_2
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It was great to have you here
Kelly, Do come back.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It was indeed, and I hope
you're willing to come back!
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Kelly McClymer
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Of course! This was fun!
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Mary Rosenblum
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Maybe when your next book comes
out? Talk to us about YA?
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Kelly McClymer
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Sounds good--I'm learning a
lot about it as we speak J
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Mary Rosenblum
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I bet! Sounds as if you're on a
roll!
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Thank you so much for spending
the evening with us!
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Kelly McClymer
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Thank you for asking me.
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Mary Rosenblum
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We'll let you go rest. We've
worked you hard!
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I will definitely ask you back!
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Have fun with the new books!
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Kelly McClymer
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Okay! Great! Bye
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Mary Rosenblum
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Good night!
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Thank you all for coming!
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Do join us in the morning for
our open chat.
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No topic, we just get together
to talk writing.
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It's right here, at 10 AM Pacific time, 11 MT, 12
Central, and 1 PM east coast.
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I'll post the transcripts in
the usual place: Surviving and Thriving: Interview Transcripts.
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Good night all, and I'll see
you in the morning!
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