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Mary Rosenblum
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Hello all!
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Mary Rosenblum
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I hope you had a very lovely
spring weekend...or at least aren't getting flooded or snowed on!
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Mary Rosenblum
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For those of you in the US, I
hope you have your taxes in.
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Mary Rosenblum
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I wanted to talk about
submissions because people always have questions about that process.
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Mary Rosenblum
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When you're a new writer
trying to break in, facing this seemingly inhuman wall of preprinted
rejection slips, it's easy to start thinking
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Mary Rosenblum
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that there's a magic key here
somewhere and you simply haven't found it yet.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And it's equally easy to feel
that all editors are out to reject all new writers, period.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And while that's not the case,
really, it IS difficult to break in and a lot of novice writers give up.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Now over all, it's easier to
break into NF than it is to break into fiction.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Name recognition doesn't play
much of a role in NF, at least not to the general public. Ability is the
key there.
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Mary Rosenblum
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In fiction, name recognition
is a factor, so it's harder for novices to make those first few sales than
it is for a competant nonfiction writer to make those first few sales.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The reality in fiction is that
you have to find the editor who LOVES this story.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And that's a subjective issue.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Yes, you have to be a strong
writer, you have to write a good story, first and foremost.
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Mary Rosenblum
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But then you're competing with
all the other novices who have written good, strong stories. And there are
only so many blank pages in the magazines and anthologies each month.
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Mary Rosenblum
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So once the editor has
winnowed the slush pile down to a few 'good enough and appeals to my
readership' stories,
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Mary Rosenblum
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that editor is probably going
to pick one.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And that one, all other things
being equal, will be the one he or she likes the most.
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Mary Rosenblum
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So when you get to an advanced
level of craft, where your stories really are publishable, then it's a
matter of trying all the editors until you
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Mary Rosenblum
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find the editor who likes the
kind of story you tell. There you'll break in.
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Mary Rosenblum
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That's where you shoot
yourself in the foot badly if you get too wounded over that first rejection
slip and file the story instead of sending it out again.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Now that does NOT mean you
should just whip out stories and keep them circulating whether they're any
good or not.
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Mary Rosenblum
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If you routinely send out
lousy stories, guess what? The editors stop reading your stories because
they're always lousy, eh?
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copper
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do you have advice on proposals,
etc. for those of us who are ready to make the leap (or think we are) from
regional mags. to nationals?
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Mary Rosenblum
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That's a big step, copper, but
a necessary one if you want to make a livable income from nonfiction. You
need two things to make that step.
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Mary Rosenblum
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One: you do need some good
clips from respectable if not huge-circulation magazines.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Two: You need to propose
pieces that the editor can use.
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Mary Rosenblum
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That means you really do need
to study your market, see what that editor has been publishing for the past
year, then propose something
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Mary Rosenblum
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that suits the mag and that
he/she hasn't done yet.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Maybe that editor already has
something like that in the works....they plan issues nearly a year ahead
most of the time.
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Mary Rosenblum
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But if that editor sees
several proposals from you that could work, even if he/she doesn't take
'em, you're likely to get a request
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Mary Rosenblum
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for a related, perhaps smaller
article, or an outright assignment to 'test the waters' so to speak.
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Mary Rosenblum
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NF editors DO need reliable
contributors they can count on when they need material.
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copper
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So far I've been a regular
contributor to one well-established regional in a big city. Do I need to
get clips in another regional before trying the national market?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Clips from more than one
regional will help you, copper, but I would go ahead and query the
nationals now. If your proposals suit the market and get the editor's
attention,
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Mary Rosenblum
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that single clip-source won't
hurt you. The editor will realize you're new but talented.
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Mary Rosenblum
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I can't stress enough though
that first impressions matter.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Editors are busy people and
they have VERY good memories.
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Mary Rosenblum
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If you send them stuff that's
entirely outside the scope of the magazine, or badly written and unedited
stories, they will remember you.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And why should they bother to
read more stuff from you when they're swamped with stuff to read from
people who DO send in quality work?
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Mary Rosenblum
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The flip side of this coin is
that if you're close, even if you're getting preprinted rejections, they
also remember you.
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Mary Rosenblum
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They'll keep an eye on you. Is
he getting better? Are her stories improving? Editors need good new
writers. They have to fill so many issues a year and they
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Mary Rosenblum
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want a good selection of
quality material.
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Mary Rosenblum
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If you're not getting negative
rejection slips (go take a writing course) then persevere.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It's VERY frustrating when you
face this wall of silence, but it's not nearly the wall of silence that you
think it is.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Editors often know your name
before you get anything other than a preprinted rejection.
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Mary Rosenblum
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At writers conferences, you'll
often find panels featuring editors, talking about what they look for from
new writers.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The answers are always
similar. They want quality writing that suits the market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And the main reason they
reject? The material does not suit the market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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There's no reason to send
inappropriate work to a particular market. You pay postage, that editor
remembers you as an idiot who didn't do his/her homework, and you waste
your time waiting for the inevitable rejection.
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Mary Rosenblum
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revswife, try using your
regular send bar at the bottom of your screen and typing /ask in front of
your question. That way you can send me a longer question.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It is a VERY good idea to
check your library or local bookstore and see if you can buy a copy of the
magazine you plan to submit to.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You can always write to the
editorial office, include the cover price of an issue and ask for a sample
copy and submission guidelines. You may get more information
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Mary Rosenblum
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than you'd get from a regular
market list.
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Mary Rosenblum
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These days, many if not most
magazines have websites and offer samples of what is included in the
issues.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The most commong 'but' I hear
to that advice is that it costs money. Well, yeah, it does. But isn't the
goal to start selling to that market?
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Mary Rosenblum
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In nonfiction, the people who
successfully start a serious feelance career with regular writing
assignments generally study a full year's worth of back issues when they
try to open a new market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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All guidelines read pretty
much the same.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Three different speculative
fiction markets may say they accept SF, fantasy, and horror.
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Mary Rosenblum
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But if you read an issue of
each, you'll find that one focuses on hard SF, one has a lot of dark
fantasy/horror, and the third is very literary.
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Mary Rosenblum
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In the NF market, slant and
voice are critical.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Your hiking article may be
very very different depending on whether you're pitching it to a magazine
on extreme hiking with a readership of twenty-somethings, or a magazine
whose readers are retirees with an eco-focus.
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Mary Rosenblum
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There it is especially
critical to read at least one or two issues.
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Mary Rosenblum
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By reading a full year's
worth, you know what your editor has covered recently and what he/she has
not covered.
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Mary Rosenblum
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I think revswife is having
trouble sending questions, but what I think she wanted to ask is if you
send your work to one market
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Mary Rosenblum
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and then find another that is
more appropriate, should you wait to hear back from the first market before
you send it out to the better, second market?
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Mary Rosenblum
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The answer is that most
markets will not accept simultaneous submissions.
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Mary Rosenblum
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That is, yes, you should wait.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Will the police show up at
your door if you do simultaneously submit?
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Mary Rosenblum
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No.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The risk is that you'll sell
to both markets and have to admit to one of those editors that you cheated.
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Mary Rosenblum
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That will probably close that
market to you for at least awhile.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The other option is that you
can send a polite note to the initial market saying that you are
withdrawing the piece from submission. BUT...why not wait?
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Mary Rosenblum
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If there's no serious time
constraing (it's breaking news), why not give the first market a try? If
they say no, submit to the better market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You thought it was a good
market when you submitted, right? (You DID do your market homework,
right?). Maybe it is.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Maybe you'll sell.
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mander
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Hi, Mary. I am new here. I often
visit archived transcripts, but this is a first live chat. My question is
about fiction short story submissions. I am writing what my instructor
calls contemporary short stories, but I'm having trouble finding markets. I
see the literary journals as options because many of them say that they
take mainstream and contemporary, but when I read sample stories, most of
them seem literary to me. Mine have insights, etc. but are probably more
plot/character driven. If I tried to use as much fluff as I see in the
literary journals, my instructor would start slashing words like crazy, I
think. Can you advise me on a path. Should I try more genre specific?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Hi, Mander. Boy, that's tough.
You really are in the most underserved segment of the market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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A lot of the 'mainstream'
short fiction markets like the Saturday Evening Post and the like are
simply gone.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You have literary which is not
mainstream and you have the genres and you don't have a lot else.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You might try to be more genre
specific, but let's face it. The short fiction market is very small. That
might change. There's an increasing interest in anthologies
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Mary Rosenblum
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and quite a few flash fiction
ezines are now paying. We may see a resurgence in short fiction yet.
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charge2charge
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what is the difference between
contemporary, mainsteam, and literary?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Those are marketign terms,
charge, and they overlap a bit.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Contemporary simply means it's
set now, not in the past, not in the future, not in another universe.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Mainstream simply means it's
not any particuliar genre, although it might have elements of romance,
mystery, and so on.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Literary means the fiction
uses literary forms and is more style driven. Plot and character tend to be
less important. Plot very much so!
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copper
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Book stores don't have back
issues, and sometimes the library doesn't carry a given mag. Do you
recommend just reading the Website and buying the current mag, or wait a
month or two to make sure and read more than one issue?
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Mary Rosenblum
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You may be able to buy a
number of back issues from a publisher, copper. Most of the nationals will
be available as back issues for about a year, I believe. (I was just
searching back issues of a large circulation archeology mag for research
purposes and had no trouble obtaining back issues).
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Mary Rosenblum
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What I suggest is that you
focus on one new market at a time, read several back issues, a year if you
can, and then spend time coming up with a few serious proposals.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Don't send 'em off together!
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Mary Rosenblum
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But send them regularly. So
that the editor begins to recognize you.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Make sure you're offering
original source material of course.
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mander
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should I work on many more short
stories and hope to build a collection before starting a novel-type of
project? Will it help find an agent to have short stories to show?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Short story and novel markets
are not the same, mander. While it helps you sell a novel if you have some
name recognition in the short story market
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Mary Rosenblum
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it's not at all necessary,
particularly in the mainstream fiction market.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Very few of the authors of
recent mainstream novels have had short fiction published much if at all.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Write short stories because
you like to write them, but not as a prerequisite to selling a novel.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Although learnging to write a
good short story will help your novel craft enormously. :-)
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Mary Rosenblum
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Do use proper manuscript
formatting when you submit.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Once upon a time, it was all
the same thing.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Now, you really do have to
read teh submission guidelines, especially for the ezines. Their formatting
requirements vary all over the map.
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Mary Rosenblum
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But you should ALWAYS read the
submission guidelines before you submit anything. Nothing ticks an editor
off like a submisison where the author clearly did not bother to look at
those guidelines first.
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mander
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So, if I'm serious about writing
mainstream fiction that sells, I might want to start my novel projects?
Well, that at least keeps me from burning up precious time on stories that
aren't really marketable. I'm getting excellent feedback from my
instructor, so maybe after my last two assignments, I'll jump into the deep
end with a novel. Thanks so much for your advice.
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Mary Rosenblum
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If novel is what you want to
write, write novel, mander. Another option is to publish your short fiction
as a collection on your own and promote the heck out of it,
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Mary Rosenblum
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but you probably won't sell
nearly enough to impress a NY publisher.
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frightwrite07
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What do you do if you're
submitting a NF article and your clips are F and could be offensive to the
current market you are submitting too? (erotica clips to Christian mag.)
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Mary Rosenblum
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Obviously, don't use those
erotica clips when you query that Christian market, fright. :-)
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Mary Rosenblum
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That's why people have pen
names, you know. :-)
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Mary Rosenblum
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Fiction clips are fine....they
don't prove you can write a good NF article, but if they're good clips,
they'll get you professional courtesy from a NF editor.
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kish100
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What DOES impress a NY
publisher?
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Mary Rosenblum
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A story that makes the editor
think it will sell 100,000 copies, Chris.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Nothing more, nothing less.
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Mary Rosenblum
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In terms of self publication
numbers, I'd say you'd need to sell 5000 copies in one year to make a NY
editor prick up his/her ears.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Ken Scholes, a local Portland
writer, made his first novel sale to Tor Books...a five book fantasy
contract.
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Mary Rosenblum
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He had virtually no
publications other than small press and ezines.
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copper
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You mentioned underlining, etc.
in the blurb in the newsletter for formatting proposals. Do you have inside
info/experience that we should know about, possibly that won't be spelled
out in the guidelines?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Generally, underlining is taken
to indicate italic or some other font besides standard.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The reason you don't want to
use fancy fonts is that the software for typesetting often throws up on
your page when you use those fancy fonts and makes a lot of work for the
typesetter.
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Mary Rosenblum
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The editor will also have to
go through your manuscript and make notes to tell the typesetter what to do
with this or that font .
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Mary Rosenblum
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Now this is changing rapidly
with the rise of small press publishers and the diversity of publishing
options.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And that is why you need to
read the guidelines.
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Mary Rosenblum
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But certainly if you are
submitting to NY publishers and major magazines, if nothing is said about
fonts/italic, use a Courier or Times New Roman font, 12 point in side, and
use underline to indicate italic.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Anything enclosed in square
brackets will not be typeset and you can make notes to the editor that way
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Mary Rosenblum
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[set off] to tell the editor
you want this section set in something besides standard font [end set off]
to tell the editor that you can now to back to standard font.
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mander
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That bit about Ken Scholes is
encouraging. I really had no idea that I could just jump right into a novel
and have someone take a serious look at it. I thought I needed to prove
something with short stories first. I've been racking my brain to find
those mainstream markets. It's been VERY frustrating for me. The literary
journals are probably tired of seeing my name too:)
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Mary Rosenblum
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Let's face it, Ken was lucky! He
sent in a single novel proposal to Tom Dougherty at Tor and Tom asked him
to expand it into a five book series.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Tom thinks it's going to be a
big seller. I hope it is! Ken's a very nice guy!
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Mary Rosenblum
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And it used to be true,
mander, that writers started in short story and then moved to novel
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Mary Rosenblum
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but that was when there was a
large short story market out there and people read a lot of them.
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Mary Rosenblum
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That's no longer true.
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mander
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Well, I'll be happy to just get
a novel manuscript written, much less published. It's a lot of work.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It's mostly a lot of work when
you're contemplating it from the vantage point of page one, mander. :-) If
you take it page by page and scene by scene it's not nearly so hard.
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mander
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I'll try that--lot's of related
short stories stitched together--or something like that.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Try the LR novel course after
you finish your current course. That will teach you the basics of novel
craft. :-)
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Mary Rosenblum
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So essentially, know what the
market really publishes before you waste time and postage and earn yourself
a bad name sending unusable work.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Read the submission guidelines
and FOLLOW them.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Send your work to all possible
markets even if you get rejected. You have to find the editor who likes
what you're doing.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Mostly BE PERSISTENT!
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Mary Rosenblum
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What do you call a persistent
writer?
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Mary Rosenblum
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Published.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Once your craft is publishable
it's a matter of knocking on the door and keeping on knocking until someone
opens it.
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Mary Rosenblum
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I wish there was a secret key
or a shortcut but there is not.
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Mary Rosenblum
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And remember, I'm doing a
yearly Most Persistent Writer Award. You'll find the rules in the LR
newsletter.
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Mary Rosenblum
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Keep track of those
submissions!
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Mary Rosenblum
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I'll post the transcripts of
this forum in the usual place:
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Mary Rosenblum
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Writing Craft: Forum
Transcripts.
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Mary Rosenblum
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You all have a good week!
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Mary Rosenblum
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Join us on Sunday for our
casual chat.
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Mary Rosenblum
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It's a great place to make new
friends and talk about whatever.
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